iPad Pros

Transcript of the Interview

Wes Hilliard

(2m 10s) Wes Hilliard:

> Well, hello Tim, I’ve been following you for a while. This is interesting. Glad to be on the show

(2m 15s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I’ve heard your voice on the Avalon Cider podcast and followed you on the Mastodon,

(2m 21s)

> and it’s good to finally be able to chat with you today.

(2m 24s) Wes Hilliard:

> Well, it’s weird people hear me. I mean I talk on a podcast, but I’ve always just thought I was the only listener So there we go

(2m 31s) Tim Chaten:

> Right. Yeah. It’s that thing where, you know, podcasters walk down the street and they’re talking and it’s like people turn their heads. They don’t know what they look like really,

(2m 39s)

> you know. Yeah. So for those who don’t know who you are and don’t listen to Apple Insider,

(2m 40s) Wes Hilliard:

> Exactly, yeah.

(2m 46s) Tim Chaten:

> they should be. Can you share a bit on your background and what you do over there at Apple

(2m 52s) Wes Hilliard:

> Alright, well it depends on how in depth we want to get here, but basically I’m relatively new to the field.

(2m 58s)

> I was in the Navy for 10 years doing something completely different.

(3m)

> I was in engineering, basically. I was an electrician in the nuclear department on a carrier.

(3m 7s)

> And then I ran my own electrical division on like these small ships called LCUs.

(3m 12s)

> So I was doing all that for about 10 years.

(3m 14s)

> And then in 2019, I separated and got picked up by Apple Insider almost by accident.

(3m 20s)

> I just happen to be kind of pokey.

(3m 22s)

> around the idea of doing some technical writing, like about technology, Apple, and, uh, Apple insider was a good fit, fell into place.

(3m 30s)

> And I’ve been there for about four years and slowly picked up some responsibilities.

(3m 35s)

> So nowadays I am basically the, well, I’m, I’m on staff as an assistant editor.

(3m 42s)

> That’s like my technical title, but I also do SEO management and social media for the company, and I’m also, you know, one of the co-hosts of the Apple Insider Podcast.

(3m 53s)

> So I’m keeping a lot of balls in the air over there at Apple Insider, so it’s kind of complicated,

(3m 58s)

> but I’m a little bit of everything at the company.

(4m) Tim Chaten:

> Okay, I’d imagine the SEO world has changed drastically in the past.

(4m 6s) Wes Hilliard:

> SEO is probably

(4m 8s)

> It’s hard to explain. It’s not really my favorite part of the job, but it’s like a necessary evil because of how Google works

(4m 16s)

> So I understand how it works and what to do to make something

(4m 20s)

> rankable, but and it’s kind of

(4m 23s)

> Infused into the way I write but I don’t try to think about it too much I just focus on the writing and on the story and everything

(4m 30s)

> But yeah, it’s definitely continues to evolve and continues to be slightly frustrating because we’re kind of fighting with this block

(4m 36s)

> black box and Google continues to insist that it’s all in the documentation

(4m 42s)

> but we see so many have so much evidence to the contrary and it really has ruined the internet and ruined the way that

(4m 50s)

> Coverage has to happen. And if anyone ever has a question about like why is Apple insider writing this?

(4m 56s)

> Why is the headline this way? Why why are these links highlighted this way in the text?

(5m 1s)

> you know, why, you know, what’s going on here? The answer is almost always SEO and please…

(5m 6s)

> you know, if you ever feel the need, you can message me on Mastodon or even email us. Our emails are usually attached to the articles we write. I’d be happy to explain why Google has ruined the internet, but yeah, I hope that maybe there’s a day in the future where we all revolt and overthrow this Google overlord, but right now it’s just kind of dictating how we present content.

(5m 27s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, no, that makes sense.

(5m 29s)

> So, what role does the iPad play in your life?

(5m 36s) Wes Hilliard:

> Well, now it’s come back full circle,

(5m 41s)

> and we can get into this,

(5m 42s)

> but I’ve basically replaced everything back to being iPad only.

(5m 46s)

> So right now I’m sitting in front of an iPad Pro on a stand.

(5m 51s)

> We are communicating over a MacBook,

(5m 53s)

> but that’s because Apple still hasn’t given us a good way to control audio intents on an iPad.

(5m 57s)

> We can’t record audio while talking on a FaceTime call.

(6m 2s)

> So yes, this is being recorded on a Mac.

(6m 4s)

> I know it’s sinful on the.

(6m 6s)

> I’ve had pros podcast, but my general day to day setup is the iPad pro connected through Thunderbolt dock to a studio display, external keyboard track pad.

(6m 16s)

> And I have an iPad mini on the side for, um, extra little tidbits.

(6m 21s)

> So we can get into all of that, but where iPad started for me.

(6m 24s)

> And what’s funny is, um, so I actually got into the Apple ecosystem in about 2014 before then I was, you know, hardcore Android all the way.

(6m 33s)

> you know, the like…

(6m 36s)

> It was terrible for me financially because I’m the tech…

(6m 39s) Tim Chaten:

> Well, every month there’s a new flagship phone.

(6m 41s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yes, yeah, and I’m one of those tech people who needs to have the latest and greatest. So,

(6m 46s)

> Samsung, Sony,

(6m 47s)

> whatever have you, like every few weeks there’d be something new and I’d be like, "Man,

(6m 51s)

> I really want to try that feature." And luckily I was in the military so I could afford it,

(6m 55s)

> but it was really stupid of me to continue to live that way. And then finally for some reason something clicked and I landed on Apple and it wasn’t until

(7m 4s)

> later when the iPad

(7m 6s)

> Pro began surfacing and Apple seemingly was more interested in making the iPad into what you’d call a professional computer replacement that I started dabbling. And of course, as a lot of us were, I was inspired by Federico Vatici over at Mac Stories and his work on iPad and it kind of gave me the idea that I don’t need to buy two computers anymore.

(7m 29s)

> I don’t need to buy an iPad Pro and a MacBook or an iMac. I could just do it all in one machine and kind of just…

(7m 36s)

> went from there. So when I actually joined Apple Insider in 2019, I was iPad only. And if your readers recall, or sorry, listeners, if your listeners recall, in 2019, the iPad did not have official cursor support. And there was no… So it was officially unofficial. So yes, it was assistive touch. We had the giant red or blue cursor dot that, you know, it was, it did the job.

(7m 52s) Tim Chaten:

> I love how you say “official cursor support” because it’s assistive touch, right?

(8m 4s)

> And you could use the Citrix X1 mouse, right?

(8m 6s) Wes Hilliard:

> I just bought a random mouse and it worked. Yeah. And then I programmed shortcuts to the side buttons and stuff. So I was making, I was forcing this device to work for me. And it did its job. Luckily, early days, my job’s much more complex now, but early days, it was mostly just technical writing, browser, text block, keyboard. And that’s, you know, and every now and then I would have to go manipulate the text and, you know, I would have to do a lot of things to make sure that it was working for me, you know, and it did the job.

(8m 11s) Tim Chaten:

> It worked okay.

(8m 36s) Wes Hilliard:

> The assistive touch was enough. But even then though, thinking back, like I was going through photos of my desk setups in January, I implemented my ultra fine display into my setup. And it reminded me, wow, we haven’t always had a full screen external display support. That’s recent, but it feels like it’s always been there just because for some reason in my head, it just, it, it’s been there long enough now that I don’t forget. I’ve forgotten the before times, the dark times of mirror displays.

(9m 7s)

> And, uh, but yes, I, I actually worked for Apple insider for my first two years only on an iPad. And it was interesting, but Apple actually made it much easier, very quickly for me. So that was March, 2020, when we got those updates and the new magic keyboard and, and trackpad support and everything really kind of fell into place. And it kind of again, clicked and said, you just got this job and you’ve been doing this kind of in a hacky way, but now Apple’s giving you the official way.

(9m 36s)

> that really set it in stone as I’m working from this computer.

(9m 39s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, no, it’s kind of amazing the slow progression that we now look back. It’s like,

(9m 45s)

> “Oh, we did it that way.” I remember back

(9m 47s) Wes Hilliard:

> We used to not have, we used to not have file system support, like not proper anyway, like just thinking back to even 2019, how I organized my files and photos and, uh, and, uh, text documents was just different because the files app was not great.

(10m 3s) Tim Chaten:

> It was just app-based and you could not hook up external hard drives, stuff like that,

(10m 7s)

> which is now super great that you can do. Yeah, in the early days, I used that Citrix X1 mouse with Jump Desktop and you could use a mouse if you’re remoting into a Mac or something.

(10m 19s)

> And it was a special mouse built for that.

(10m 22s) Wes Hilliard:

> Oh, that’s funny. I remember experimenting a lot with different applications to try and

(10m 28s)

> one of the things that inspired me to go all in on Apple was, uh, cause I think 2014 might be important to some people who’ve been around for a while because that’s when Apple really leaned into something called, um, what’s, what’s the word for sharing everything across devices.

(10m 46s)

> It’s, uh, it’s how you see the app icons in your doc. Um.

(10m 50s) Tim Chaten:

> Oh, yeah, the…

(10m 52s) Wes Hilliard:

> It, this is how old this technology is. Uh,

(10m 54s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I know what you’re talking about. You can turn it off. I’ve done this before because some people in my family don’t like it.

(10m 59s) Wes Hilliard:

> right. But, but yes, it’s, it’s a gosh, it’s, it’ll come to me in five minutes,

(11m 5s)

> but it basically the idea that all the computers are talking to each other. Um, and if you’re part of Apple’s ecosystem, uh, continuity, I’m sorry, continuity is that there we go. So Apple introduced the concept of continuity in 2014 that.

(11m 14s) Tim Chaten:

> That’s right

(11m 18s)

> Like right now my iPhone’s saying do you want to move this FaceTime call to your iPhone? It’s like no I do not

(11m 22s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah. Just take a walk, take a walk around your living room. Maybe. Yeah. There you go. Um,

(11m 27s)

> yeah, it’s, it’s interesting how it’s evolved, but just again, just to get to the iPad point,

(11m 33s)

> continuity is what led us to making the iPad better because of universal control. Now it’s part of that continuity system, right? Everything. Yeah. So, so as part of my use case and, uh,

(11m 43s) Tim Chaten:

> and copying and pasting between iPad, iPhone, or iPhone and Mac.

(11m 50s) Wes Hilliard:

> for my iPad.

(11m 52s)

> I’m going to show you how to do that.

(11m 59s)

> I’m going to show you how to do that.

(12m 6s)

> clipboard management system, but I’m running the clipboard manager paste on the iPad mini and because of universal clipboard, I can copy and paste to my heart’s content on the iPad and there’s a whole history of it building on my iPad mini and all I have to do is reach

(12m 22s)

> the clipboard.

(12m 27s) Tim Chaten:

> So the mini is just there kind of running this app kind of as a accessory computer.

(12m 33s) Wes Hilliard:

> Mm-hmm

(12m 33s) Tim Chaten:

> You don’t have to interact with the mini at all.

(12m 35s)

> It’s just ambiently capturing your clipboard.

(12m 38s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yes, and so there’s two windows open on the iPad mini

(12m 41s)

> The other one is slack and anyone who works for a company with slack knows

(12m 45s)

> That slack is very temperamental. And if you leave the window the green dot turns off and now you’re no longer at work. So

(12m 54s)

> So I keep slack running and then I keep paste running at all times on the iPad mini and that sadly

(13m)

> that’s just the place the iPad mini has fallen and

(13m 3s)

> we’ll get into it later but I have plans for a future that will free up the iPad mini by using my spare Mac as kind of a server computer to run all these silly things in the background so I don’t have to have my iPad mini wasting its resources.

(13m 19s) Tim Chaten:

> Sure. Yeah. And your iPad Pro, it’s the M1 or M2 or 2021?

Current iPad Pro Setup

(13m 26s) Wes Hilliard:

> So, M1, so 2020, so, oh, yeah, ’21, that’s right, ’cause ’20 is when the M1 actually came out.

(13m 29s) Tim Chaten:

> 2021, I think. Yeah.

(13m 35s)

> Yeah. 2020, we had the Magic Keyboard with the camera.

(13m 42s) Wes Hilliard:

> Right. Right.

(13m 44s)

> So I’ve actually owned every iPad pro, um, since the iPad pro came out.

(13m 49s)

> And I remember the first time I opened the box thinking, is this a joke?

(13m 52s)

> Like it’s so large,

(13m 55s)

> especially coming from like a 10.5 inch iPad, you open the box and it’s like,

(13m 59s)

> almost like one of those novelty gag things. That’s makes your,

(14m 2s)

> that’s like a giant candy bar. You’re looking at it like, wow,

(14m 6s)

> is this really an iPad? And then they’ve, you know,

(14m 9s)

> refined it to the flat sides,

(14m 10s)

> but I’ve, I’ve owned everyone up to the.

(14m 13s)

> And the M two just did not entice me. I didn’t, I am an Apple pencil user,

(14m 17s)

> but I’m not that much of a user.

(14m 18s)

> So hover was all they really added that was new for the consumer side and M one didn’t feel slow and it still doesn’t feel slow. So, especially for my workflows.

(14m 27s)

> So yeah, I’m still on the M one iPad pro 12.9 inch one, you know,

(14m 31s)

> one terabyte of storage, cellular data, of course

(14m 34s) Tim Chaten:

> Yes. Yeah, the one terabyte also gets you the more RAM, so that’s…

(14m 39s) Wes Hilliard:

> The RAM that I don’t think.

(14m 42s)

> Any professional app actually takes advantage of some games do,

(14m 46s)

> but I don’t know of anyone that actually the, the application system,

(14m 51s)

> the layer below the application does kick that in if it needs to.

(14m 56s)

> So it can, you know, manage more tabs and Safari and stuff like that.

(14m 59s)

> But as far as like an app loading up that much RAM,

(15m 2s)

> there’s probably very few of any that actually use that.

(15m 4s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I think LumaFusion has stopped crashing for me when I leave it in the background.

(15m 10s)

> And I wonder if it’s part of the RAM story with that iPad.

(15m 14s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, I definitely think it’s better for stuff like stage manager where you’re going to have more things running at once

(15m 22s)

> But even then stage manager is tricky because it doesn’t really let anything run in the background unless it specifically has permission to

(15m 28s)

> It’s an oddity. That’s that’s that that’s the black box. That’s the iPad where

(15m 32s)

> All of us who are actually iPad Pro users who maybe go all in on this system Know that as much fun as it is to use there are some odd

(15m 41s)

> limitations and odd workarounds that you have to get through.

(15m 44s) Tim Chaten:

> It is interesting the stage manager situation where I’ve got 16 gigs of RAM. Can I have

(15m 50s)

> 8 windows instead of my 4 that the 8 gigabyte people get but but no

(15m 55s) Wes Hilliard:

> Right. I mean, and so the funny thing with me is I often feel a little bit of,

(16m)

> uh, what you would call, what’s, what’s the word? Um,

(16m 4s)

> imposter syndrome, because like,

(16m 6s)

> I know that I’m using my iPad in a professional way,

(16m 11s)

> but I don’t, you know, I’m not a coder. I’m not building apps. I’m not building,

(16m 15s)

> you know, complex graphical designs and stuff like that,

(16m 18s)

> but I’m still utilizing it in a way that consumers wouldn’t. So it’s, it’s,

(16m 23s) Tim Chaten:

> – Right.

(16m 25s)

> Do you, is editing the Apple Insider Podcast your role,

(16m 29s)

> or is that what Steven does?

(16m 31s) Wes Hilliard:

> Steven handled it, now I believe William’s going to be running some of that, we’re discussing getting me trained up in editing, because that’s just something I’ve never had to handle.

(16m 42s)

> Remember, this industry’s new to me.

(16m 45s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, fair right’s a fun thing to do with the iPad, I will say.

(16m 49s)

> Like…

(16m 49s) Wes Hilliard:

> That’s one reason why I wouldn’t mind taking over some editing responsibilities, I already have too many things on my plate but I might as well add one more.

(16m 58s)

> Like I’ve definitely considered it like I’ve heard ferrites just really

(17m 1s)

> intuitive and it’s still work like you know I’ve you know it’s still you’re still editing a podcast but yeah for sure and yeah it’s definitely something I need to get into if only to alleviate some responsibility from William but no I don’t edit the podcast and I’m not running video over here we have our own video person Andrew if any…

(17m 4s) Tim Chaten:

> It is. And they did add a, yeah, they added the 2x playback speed during editing, which is is just a godsend for editors because you can add it twice as quickly pretty much.

(17m 31s) Wes Hilliard:

> one goes to Apple Insider YouTube. He’s actually kind of a one-man machine over there. Yes, he’s co-host on HomeKit Insider and Steven also handed editing that podcast so again we’ll see how we’re gonna handle that going forward.

(17m 35s) Tim Chaten:

> He’s the guy that is also on HomeKit Insider.

(17m 49s) Wes Hilliard:

> But yes, that pretty much all fell to Steven and he was obsessed with the iPad mini and ferrite on there and editing from you know his back porch or whatever So definitely, definitely.

(17m 55s) Tim Chaten:

> Yes.

(18m 1s) Wes Hilliard:

> A good iPad use case editing podcasts.

(18m 3s) Tim Chaten:

> For sure. And you guys use Fireside, which means you can… Riverside, sorry. What is Fireside?

(18m 7s) Wes Hilliard:

> Uh, not fireside, uh, riverside river river.

(18m 13s)

> Yeah, that one.

(18m 14s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, Riverside. Well, you’re at the… Yeah. But Riverside, which means you can do all this from the iPad. You don’t need the Mac like we’re doing today with FaceTime to record.

(18m 23s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, so for anyone curious, my current iPad setup, so I’ve written it down so I can get it all in one go, it’s it’s pretty fun.

(18m 32s)

> So I have the iPad 12.9 inch iPad Pro hooked up to what you’d call a Q2 magnetic arm.

(18m 39s)

> And it’s you can look it up.

(18m 42s)

> There’s a review on Apple Insider, but it hovers the iPad above the desk.

(18m 46s)

> And it’s one of those magnet, one of those arms that you can move it freely.

(18m 49s)

> And the iPad attaches via its back magnets.

(18m 52s)

> there’s no grips or anything.

(18m 53s)

> So that’s really nice and then it’s Thunderbolt connected through a StarDock Thunderbolt 4 dock with a bunch of ports and external Thunderbolt connections.

(19m 6s)

> Through that to the studio display and then I have the Keychron Q3 Pro SE Keyboard Magic Trackpad because it’s the only trackpad in existence that’s worth getting and then something else we’ll get into I have the Asus I believe…

(19m 23s)

> I’m pretty happy with where I’ve landed and this is probably where it’s gonna stay for a while.

(19m 49s)

> Keychron.

(19m 49s) Tim Chaten:

> What’s the keyboard you’re using is that a multiple multiple device keyboard?

(19m 53s) Wes Hilliard:

> So, I hardwire everything, but technically, yeah, if I switch it over to Bluetooth, there’s a command where I can switch between three radios to switch between devices if I wanted

(20m 6s) Tim Chaten:

> Okay. Yeah, I was wondering if the iPad Mini, if there would be utility in doing the multi-device thing with that, with the Mini. And even your iPhone, potentially.

(20m 14s) Wes Hilliard:

> well so that’s that’s what I was going to get into potentially those devices are pretty static the iPhone actually I have a I believe it’s the Nomad charging base what that lets it do standby mode and so the iPhone actually is in front of the keyboard in standby mode and I can I usually have the now playing music on that so I could have quick controls for that because my home pods

(20m 44s)

> I have two home pods in the office that are usually playing something and then the iPad mini and iPhone there’s just no keyboard tasks for those slack funny enough slacks running on the iPad mini but if I need to message someone open it on the iPad Pro but that that’s the yeah

(20m 55s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, you open it.

(21m 1s)

> Yeah, it’s kind of, it’s kind of interesting with the iPhone.

(21m 6s)

> It’s kind of nice with the keyboard.

(21m 8s)

> Like it’s a nice little tidy, just one app screen.

(21m 11s)

> That’s like, it’s nice to just like knock out some text and to bed and iPhone.

(21m 15s) Wes Hilliard:

> I’ve said it before, but the perfect computing device,

(21m 20s)

> if this futuristic thing that Apple’s never going to do would be an iPad mini,

(21m 25s)

> that was just everything.

(21m 26s)

> Just give me an iPhone camera, give me the M2 or M3 processor,

(21m 33s)

> give me the 120 hertz ProMotion display, Thunderbolt connection,

(21m 36s)

> 8-inch screen, and then just replace everything.

(21m 40s)

> I don’t need an iPhone.

(21m 41s)

> I don’t need an iPad Pro.

(21m 43s)

> plug it into an external display.

(21m 45s)

> a phone.

(21m 46s)

> Like I said, it’s definitely an interesting setup, so like my iPad mini is actually kind of my main device most of the day.

(21m 49s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, well what you need is the Apple Watch to become your main phone and then the iPad is just your accessory to that.

(22m 13s) Wes Hilliard:

> It goes with me.

(22m 15s)

> I have like, I usually have it in a pocket or something nearby just to use as I’m moving around the house.

(22m 22s)

> The iPad Pro really has evolved into just being a work machine and it’s mostly used in the office or you know, if I’m doing work somewhere else in the house, it comes with me on the magic keyboard, but it really has just kind of turned into that kind of thing.

(22m 37s)

> And every now and then it kind of comes back to being consumer-ish.

(22m 41s)

> I’ll check out a video game like from Apple Arcade on the big screen or.

(22m 45s)

> Run it on the studio display, or I’ll use discord, but I’ve been trying to find ways to bring it back more into my

(22m 53s)

> Personal use case because it used to be my personal computer I just don’t compute that way anymore because I spend all my time working on it. It’s kind of fun

(23m 1s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, and the mini seems so much more fun to just walk

(23m 7s) Wes Hilliard:

> It’s the best iPad as a tablet, for sure.

(23m 12s)

> Like, if you’re looking for like Steve Jobs’ vision of sitting on the couch reading the newspaper or, you know, that kind of thing,

(23m 18s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah.

(23m 19s) Wes Hilliard:

> this is that iPad, and Apple really hit it out of the park with it.

Future iPads

(23m 23s) Tim Chaten:

> Are you more likely to update that iPad when the Mini gets its next update versus the M3 iPad Pro?

(23m 31s) Wes Hilliard:

> I’m doing both so I skipped I think we got off track but I skipped the m2 generation for a reason it just didn’t feel like there was enough there but m3 actually checks a lot of boxes that I want to have in my ecosystem but but but for sure iPad mini yes as soon as because it’s it’s getting actually the older it it definitely needs an update and I’m very curious as to how they’re going to update it this cycle but yes the iPad mini 7 is definitely on my

Tasks for the iPad Pro

(24m 3s) Tim Chaten:

> So your computering tasks for Apple Insider, SEO, writing, what’s the hit list of things

(24m 13s) Wes Hilliard:

> So generally speaking, so I’m on the studio display with the iPad pro right off to the right hovering next to it.

(24m 20s)

> So I’m usually running three, four apps at the same time.

(24m 24s)

> I’m not a heavy windowing user.

(24m 26s)

> So stage manager has been great, but I’m not, I don’t have 15 things open at once.

(24m 32s)

> Every now and then I might have three windows on the same screen, but that’s mostly rare.

(24m 37s) Tim Chaten:

> And is the iPad screen utilized in some way?

(24m 41s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, so that’s, that’s what I was getting at.

(24m 44s)

> My job kind of all blends together.

(24m 46s)

> So all those titles become kind of just one big job because my daily job is I work the evening shift.

(24m 54s)

> So I actually go into work around 3 PM till about 11 or so and I’m on my own.

(25m 1s)

> So I’m in charge of finding the news and covering it.

(25m 7s)

> So, and, but I’m also in charge of maintaining social media.

(25m 11s)

> So on my iPad screen, I’ll.

(25m 13s)

> Usually have four apps open, actually using all four apps, which is mass it on Twitter.

(25m 19s)

> Yes, I know, but, but we’re on there.

(25m 22s)

> Um, I have a net news wire for RSS and.

(25m 29s)

> Oh, Apple news, uh, open that, that, that was a recent addition because, um, there’s a few companies that publish through Apple news pretty quickly.

(25m 39s)

> And if you follow the Apple channel.

(25m 43s)

> it actually updates, uh, almost faster sometimes than social media can,

(25m 47s)

> but those are my four apps open.

(25m 49s)

> And then I have a threads Instagram page available on another, um,

(25m 54s)

> stage, but, uh, that that’s my basically

(25m 58s)

> amalgamation of here’s social media, here’s your news RSS,

(26m 2s)

> but all of that feeds into,

(26m 4s)

> I’m constantly keeping my eyes open for what’s new,

(26m 8s)

> what’s news coverage for the night, but also,

(26m 12s)

> So on the main screen, I’m running.

(26m 13s)

> Stuff like Pixelmator or a Photomator for editing images.

(26m 18s)

> Then I have Affinity Design for creating images.

(26m 23s)

> So it really just depends on which pipeline I need for generating an image.

(26m 27s)

> I use Pix– sorry, I do this every time, PixSew.

(26m 32s)

> It’s like sewing.

(26m 34s)

> So for generating framed iPhone images and then importing it to Designer.

(26m 39s)

> So that I have a whole image pipeline together.

(26m 41s)

> pipeline together. I actually.

(26m 43s)

> Right in drafts. Everything I do is in drafts. Um,

(26m 46s)

> there’s probably tens of thousands of documents inside drafts.

(26m 49s)

> I’ll never look at again, but I never delete anything.

(26m 52s)

> I just create a new draft right when I’m going to write and then I take it to where I need it to go. Um, and because the number one rule,

(26m 59s) Tim Chaten:

> That includes social media posting from draft.

(27m 2s) Wes Hilliard:

> um, not, well,

(27m 3s)

> it depends on how complex it is because sometimes you need the same posts in different places. And we have a, we have a, one of those posting tools.

(27m 8s) Tim Chaten:

> Yes. And sometimes you want to be drafting in the client so you know how many characters you

(27m 11s) Wes Hilliard:

[laughs]

(27m 14s)

> – Right, well, Drafts tells you that too.

(27m 18s)

> And actually I use Drafts a lot for counting characters ’cause it’s important for headline creation and stuff like that.

(27m 24s)

> But Drafts is pretty much my default go-to,

(27m 28s)

> but I actually also employ IA Writer

(27m 31s)

> because IA Writer,

(27m 32s)

> you can create your own internal file system and you can make it reliant on the files app as well.

(27m 39s)

> So you’re generating through the app a file structure.

(27m 44s)

> Well, I’ll get to that in a second ’cause that’s actually kind of interesting.

(27m 49s)

> So Drafts is always open next to Safari,

(27m 52s)

> those two windows just coincide.

(27m 56s)

> And then I have stuff like files and mail and stuff like that on the main screen.

(27m 59s)

> So my job generally is the news,

(28m 4s)

> but when there’s no news to do, I have other things, right?

(28m 7s)

> So I’m writing reviews for the website and that’s processing images.

(28m 11s)

> I’m taking photos with my.

(28m 13s)

> You know, DSLR, sometimes my iPhone, you’ll be surprised actually how many reviews I just photographed with my iPhone.

(28m 19s)

> Uh, I wonder if anyone can usually tell the difference.

(28m 23s)

> Let’s see.

(28m 23s)

> So I use, I use, uh, external tools like timer.

(28m 26s)

> He tracks my time.

(28m 27s)

> Grammarly is great because yes, even though on iPad, I can’t track everything I’m writing, I can take the text from drafts, paste it into Grammarly, get my grammar, all that stuff checked, and then take that text to the publisher and Safari and get it into our, our Apple.

(28m 43s)

> Insider’s publishing system, get everything up to date, publish, you know,

(28m 47s)

> so that’s basically my, my news workflow.

(28m 49s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, so you’re not using their, uh, their weird keyboard thing.

(28m 52s) Wes Hilliard:

> Their weird keyboard thing. Oh, Grammarly. So Grammarly. Yeah. Uh,

(28m 57s)

> it’s weird. So I,

(29m 1s)

> I do not use alternative keyboards and it doesn’t work with hardware keyboards,

(29m 4s)

> funny enough. So it wouldn’t even activate while it’s connected through the doc.

(29m 9s)

> But they do have a Safari extension that I have turned on for our.

(29m 13s)

> um, publishing website. And that’s the only place it’s turned on for,

(29m 17s)

> but it’s hit and miss. Uh, honestly,

(29m 19s)

> using the app is the best way to go and it works fine. Um, because you just,

(29m 24s)

> I don’t even actually create new documents in Grammarly.

(29m 26s)

> I just have one document that I overwrite every time. Um,

(29m 30s)

> but that workflow is pretty seamless. Um, I actually can get from,

(29m 35s)

> I see a news item to publication within 15 to 20 minutes.

(29m 39s)

> And that’s like three, 400 words,

(29m 41s)

> depending on what it is, because my workflows.

(29m 43s)

> I’m pretty efficient. I actually use shortcuts with my drafts.

(29m 47s)

> So Slack has the shortcuts app open next to it on the iPad.

(29m 52s)

> So I switched to that window and then have drafts open on the, um,

(29m 55s)

> stage manager on, or I’m sorry, on the studio display.

(29m 59s)

> And if I need to link something like, uh,

(30m 2s)

> I have separate shortcuts for generating Amazon affiliate links or,

(30m 7s)

> um, just generated standard links,

(30m 9s)

> like to our website by highlighting the text and hitting a button in draft.

(30m 13s)

> So that’s all pretty streamlined and drafts has a way to do this internally, so it’s taken some time, but a lot of my text manipulation can happen through shortcuts pretty easily and getting to the next point. I wanted to say, I know I’m rambling, but hey, I’m on a podcast, right?

(30m 37s)

> So, my other job, so when I’m not doing news, which can sometimes be an entirely different thing.

The Wiki

(30m 43s) Wes Hilliard:

> I have other projects and this is where the SEO side comes in. And if anyone’s ever curious, I don’t know, guys, go navigate Apple insider. If you’re ever in an article and you see the word, I don’t know, iPhone 15, a Mac book pro, like if you see a device name highlighted, you click it and it takes you to what we refer to as kind of our internal wiki.

(31m 8s)

> wiki oh it’s I run it it’s not a wikipedia I know everyone can edit wiki whatever

(31m 13s)

> but I run this thing it’s we call it our inside pages it’s actually in the url slash inside so if you ever find yourself on a slash inside slash like iphone iphone 15 device name insert here um i’m i’m the manager for that and we have like something like I don’t know it’s

(31m 32s)

> nearly 200 pages at this point that I have to go through and keep up to date with all the new information yeah it gets a little overwhelming but I have a whole system for that too on the the iPad using reminders.

(31m 44s)

> But yeah, I, I encourage everyone to go poke around our inside pages sometime.

(31m 48s)

> Um, they’re just, they’re just fun little informational things. Here’s usually,

(31m 52s)

> usually it’s the rumor cycle. Like here’s, uh, cause I’m also,

(31m 56s)

> if you look at my title, um, kind of, uh, we actually don’t do that. I know,

(31m 57s) Tim Chaten:

> Like, should I buy this Mac Mini?

(32m 1s) Wes Hilliard:

> I know like Mac rumors has like a green red check Mark kind of system.

(32m 6s)

> Um, mine’s mostly informational. It’s, this is what this device is.

(32m 10s)

> These are the specs for it. This is what Apple calls it.

(32m 13s)

> It’s really just very much informational. This is when it came out.

(32m 16s)

> This is when it was updated. These are the rumors for the next device. Anyway,

(32m 20s)

> long story short, think of it like a wiki.

(32m 22s)

> And so I run this and that’s where I a writer comes in.

(32m 26s)

> So I have a structured file system and I a writer for all the inside pages

(32m 31s)

> where I keep canonical versions of the inside pages.

(32m 34s)

> I take the text too from drafts,

(32m 36s)

> paste it in and then do my SEO work for calculating density and all that nonsense. All their peak calcs open next.

(32m 43s)

> I have a lot of fun with it.

(32m 53s) Tim Chaten:

> I love as a writer that, you know, PCalc is like a tool in your tool set, like calculations as a, like an author.

(33m) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, so that’s half of half of SEO’s calculations, which is really weird

(33m 5s)

> You have to know how many times a word appears in a piece

(33m 9s)

> but yes, so like that’s kind of my writing setup and

(33m 13s)

> Pretty like again. I’ve been refining this for years. There’s always room for improvement, but

(33m 18s)

> Sorry, this is all really boring to listeners, but I just like when it comes to writing there’s a lot of tools involved I think a lot of people think that you guys that we just open publisher and Safari and we just work there all day

(33m 31s)

> like our oh

(33m 31s) Tim Chaten:

> I would not advise it especially on iPads.

(33m 34s) Wes Hilliard:

> No, yeah, I mean it for anyone who doesn’t know if you if you’re writing text in a browser

(33m 41s)

> More than 10 words probably don’t because all it takes is one like browser crash or refresh and all that text is gone So who nobody nobody who knows what they’re doing works from inside a browser window for sure

Big Stories?

(33m 57s) Tim Chaten:

> What have been some of the biggest stories that have broken during your shift?

(34m)

> I know OpenAI was going nuts during the evening hours.

(34m 5s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, you know, that’s a good question. Um, I don’t

(34m 10s)

> actually the open AI stuff was so convoluted that I kind of just let day shifts handle it because

(34m 16s)

> Because so much would happen on on the shift that it just it it would be lost on the readers. It didn’t matter

(34m 21s) Tim Chaten:

> It’s like, here’s the 20th update to the–

(34m 25s) Wes Hilliard:

> Um, I get to have some fun like I I I wrote a story titled you’re still gonna get bullied for

(34m 35s)

> Greenbubble when RCS arrives

(34m 38s)

> so like that that news arrived and nine-to-five actually got a hold of Apple and

(34m 43s)

> We we covered that that information that RCS will still be a green bubble text Apple’s not changing that when that comes along

(34m 50s)

> Big news that’s broken. I mean, I don’t know my brain doesn’t categorize it that way. I’m just kind of doing the job

(34m 57s)

> So I don’t I don’t have any distinct memories of anything being too crazy

(35m) Tim Chaten:

> And I’d imagine during Apple’s October event that was at night, the whole team probably held.

(35m 5s) Wes Hilliard:

> That was fun.

(35m 6s)

> Yeah, everyone, yeah, if it’s an event, it’s all hands,

(35m 10s)

> even if it’s something weird like that, which is probably never gonna happen again.

(35m 16s)

> But yeah, we’re all usually there turning away.

(35m 18s)

> And even the 1 PM events, we might all be here until 6, 7 o’clock.

(35m 24s)

> Or earnings call is usually kind of a funny one cuz that’s at 4 to 5 PM.

(35m 29s)

> And then if there’s a bunch of news there, we’re all working until 8,

(35m 32s)

> 9 o’clock.

(35m 33s) Tim Chaten:

> I miss the Steve Jobs days of the earnings calls, they were much more entertaining.

(35m 33s) Wes Hilliard:

> But–

(35m 35s)

> Yeah, I don’t really know why we cover them other than there’s general interest, but it’s like everyone on earth covers them So it’s not like we’re gonna have anything new to add

(35m 46s)

> But yeah, it’s it’s just one of those things that we we want to be part of the conversation So we do just in case something something crazy happens and every now and then we get a little tidbit That’s actually newsworthy from the earnings call. So it makes it worth it

Your Time with the Mac

(36m 2s) Tim Chaten:

> And so during the first two years of using the iPad,

(36m 5s)

> you started without a trackpad support.

(36m 8s)

> And then 2020, we got that, the Magic Keyboard,

(36m 11s)

> and that was a great moment.

(36m 14s)

> And then, you know, Apple Silicon started to roll out and along for the ride meant these Macs started to get

(36m 23s)

> the fancy iPad chips and some redesigns,

(36m 28s)

> which made them very appealing.

(36m 29s)

> So tell me a bit.

(36m 32s)

> About this move in 2021 to see what the max.

(36m 38s) Wes Hilliard:

> Okay, so I’d used Mac before so I wasn’t totally alien to the system But when I was using a Mac previously, I felt like what am I what am I using this thing for?

(36m 45s)

> I’m not a professional. I’m you know browsing the internet like anyone else. I’m using reddit. I’m using Twitter

(36m 51s)

> Why do I have an entire Mac sitting here?

(36m 53s)

> So I that was part of my reason for just kind of falling into iPad in the first place because I just did

(36m 58s)

> Yeah, I just felt like it was it was a lot for nothing. It felt

(37m 3s)

> The classic that this is going to be controversial and even on the iPads Pro podcast

(37m 8s)

> I’m sure someone’s going to let me know but I just felt like the

(37m 14s)

> desktop paradigm Apple’s Mac MacBook Mac OS

(37m 17s)

> Was dated it’s ancient. It feels like I go back in time every time I use it

(37m 23s)

> Like I’m I’m back in Windows

(37m 26s)

> 2,000 days of moving a cursor and clicking an icon and you know, just wow Bob I’m on the internet. Like it’s just I don’t know it felt it felt very dated and it felt very

(37m 38s)

> Silicon so it and then the iPad felt fun whimsical new and just the way the operating system works the way the apps are designed

(37m 45s)

> It all just felt different in a way that’s hard to kind of explain

(37m 50s)

> But then Apple Silicon came about and I was like, huh? Okay, that’s interesting

(37m 54s)

> But what really clicked was two things happening almost within a month of each other

(38m)

> Universal control getting announced and kind of saying hey, you know the iPad you have sitting there

(38m 6s)

> If you have a Mac it

(38m 8s)

> gets superpowers. But on top of that you get the new redesigned 14-inch MacBook Pro revitalizing the line from the sad 15-inch days. And you know 16-inch did come around in 2019 but we kind of ignore that one. But like this was the revitalized computer, new curved edge design, just everything about it. It checked a dozen boxes at once and macOS was getting all.

(38m 38s)

> Of these new features and Apple Silicon was amazing.

(38m 42s)

> It was just kind of a big euphoric rise for the Mac and everyone remembers that.

(38m 45s)

> And I just kind of got caught up in the storm and I was like, you know what?

(38m 49s)

> Let’s try it. I want to see what working with universal control is like.

(38m 53s)

> And I ordered a 14 inch MacBook pro.

(38m 55s)

> I even wrote a whole story on Apple insider about my decision making process and moving back to the Mac. And, um, that was in 21.

(39m 3s)

> So I was iPad only at Apple insider for two years.

(39m 8s)

> Um, by the end of that two years, my job had actually grown into what it is now.

(39m 13s)

> Um, so it was already very complex, but I was still managing it from an iPad.

(39m 16s)

> So it always,

(39m 17s)

> I always had to laugh when I hear people say iPads on a real computer,

(39m 21s)

> you can’t do real work from it. And I’m just over here like, all right,

(39m 24s)

> what do you classify as work? And usually those people say, you know,

(39m 27s)

> coding or web development or networking. And I’m like, yeah,

(39m 31s)

> you’re not going to use an iPad for that. Go buy, go buy a Mac,

(39m 34s)

> but that doesn’t make the iPad any less because of that. But anyway,

(39m 38s)

> so the Mac book, uh, was interesting because it, again,

(39m 43s)

> it’s just, it was all the new hotness. I came in,

(39m 46s)

> I got like a set up subscription,

(39m 49s)

> but I kind of started using it like an iPad. Funny enough, I,

(39m 54s)

> I kind of just carried my workflows back from the iPad to the Mac book,

(39m 58s)

> set it up on the studio display. And again,

(40m)

> even then still no external display support for iPad. So I was like, wow,

(40m 5s)

> My studio display has a full screen now!

(40m 7s) Tim Chaten:

> You’re right.

(40m 8s) Wes Hilliard:

> I set up the iPads next to it and now I could move my cursor from Macbook to studio display to iPad Pro to iPad Mini seamlessly.

(40m 18s)

> Yes, there were glitches, but it’s mostly refined at this point and it all worked.

(40m 24s)

> My workflow didn’t actually change that much.

(40m 26s)

> Still wrote in drafts, still utilized Pixelmator Pro for my photo pipeline, which actually could be everything.

(40m 38s)

> Macbook Pro works, I didn’t need Affinity, I didn’t need any other app.

(40m 41s)

> I was able to do everything in there and I am begging that company, please bring that to iPad and I will never ask for anything ever again.

(40m 51s)

> But yes, I utilized the Macbook Pro for about two years, funny enough.

(40m 56s)

> So two years on iPad, two years on Macbook Pro, using a very similar workflow.

(41m)

> What’s different though, was basically universal control, clipboard management, and a lot of

(41m 8s)

> stuff.

(41m 9s)

> Stuff like, I could have menu bar apps that do certain things, I could run desktop Chrome,

(41m 17s)

> which was necessary for our affiliate system.

(41m 20s)

> There’s a lot of links that you generate from an extension tool inside Chrome.

(41m 25s)

> And actually that’s one of only two reasons why I still need a Mac somewhere in my house while I’m at work.

(41m 33s)

> So that wasn’t really an issue when I first got here, but sometimes I do help generate some of the text for these.

(41m 38s)

> post or yada yada or like a review will have a link that goes through a certain website and again you just need that chrome extension that isn’t available anywhere else so yes I would need to have a mac available or I would have to go knock on one of our other employee stores every time I needed a link said hey can you make this into an affiliate process link or whatever and

(41m 57s) Tim Chaten:

> That’s kind of wild, there’s no website you can go to to generate that.

(42m) Wes Hilliard:

> i’ve i’ve had it rolling around in the back of my head I really want to create like a stupid 300

(42m 8s)

> dollars link that’s just a shortcut that just detects what the website is and generates the proper link and gives you the option to add the necessary parameters uh with text input and outputs a properly affiliated link but that would take a long time to figure out because there are there’s a

(42m 25s) Tim Chaten:

> Oh, I see. Because you’re trying to do multiple. It’s not just Amazon. It’s like we have a thousand. Yeah, gotcha. Right.

(42m 32s) Wes Hilliard:

> shortcut for because all so I have a it strips the unnecessary parts and then adds

(42m 38s)

> back are it’s like a four character thing or whatever and then and now you have your link

(42m 42s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, but you guys do affiliates for like target.com and like other just random sites?

(42m 45s) Wes Hilliard:

> sure like bnh bnh photo like is one or like you know if I if we want to sell something from nomad

(42m 53s)

> and yeah I know people are rolling their eyes like yeah affiliates whatever but guys you know we gotta make you gotta make money you know and so if you’re ever out there trying to shop for something go good go to your favorite website and click on a link to that thing because you’re you’re helping people out doing that, honestly.

(42m 57s) Tim Chaten:

> That’s how you pay the bills.

(43m 8s) Wes Hilliard:

> You’re not losing any money doing that, just saying, but, um,

(43m 11s) Tim Chaten:

> No, just the big company like Amazon.

(43m 13s) Wes Hilliard:

> yeah, there you’re taking a little off the top, you know, and there you go.

(43m 17s)

> Anti-capitalism. There you go. Um, but, but yeah,

(43m 18s) Tim Chaten:

> Exactly.

(43m 20s) Wes Hilliard:

> so there’s a lot of these websites like nomads, a techie, what,

(43m 24s)

> what have you that you can’t just tag the end of the URL with a slash AI code three or whatever. And it works.

(43m 33s)

> That’s just not how it works.

(43m 34s)

> You have to go through these like weird linking systems. So, um,

(43m 38s)

> redirect when you click on a link, that’s usually what it is. It’s,

(43m 40s)

> it’s taking you through an affiliate portal, uh,

(43m 43s)

> just some inside baseball there guys. But, um, and it’s safe.

(43m 47s)

> Don’t worry about it. But like, don’t worry.

(43m 50s)

> Apple insider is not trying to do anything weird. We just want money. Um, but yeah,

(43m 54s)

> so that is just unavailable. It’s just,

(43m 56s)

> it doesn’t exist and it would actually be really complex to try and generate the,

(44m)

> the thing that would probably save me,

(44m 2s)

> which will never happen is if they take their extension and make it Safari compatible which might make me able to add it to the iPad.

(44m 8s)

> But again, they’re not interested in that. They don’t care.

(44m 11s)

> They’re just going to keep making their Chrome extension, but that’s just,

(44m 14s)

> but yeah, that’s one of two things, but, um,

(44m 17s) Tim Chaten:

> What’s the other thing?

(44m 18s) Wes Hilliard:

> podcasting.

(44m 19s) Tim Chaten:

> Oh, yes.

(44m 20s) Wes Hilliard:

> So I need to have that around to properly record audio while talking to

(44m 25s)

> someone. Uh, funny enough, I did podcast from an iPad only, um,

(44m 30s)

> back in the early days when I joined Apple insider podcast and, uh,

(44m 35s)

> you know how we did it.

(44m 37s)

> I…

(44m 38s)

> I would take the call through Skype on my iPad mini and over an AirPod in my left ear and then have my microphone hooked up to the iPad Pro with, uh, gosh, what is that recording software called?

(44m 52s) Tim Chaten:

> Mm-hmm. Is it ferrite?

(44m 56s) Wes Hilliard:

> Um, it might’ve been Fairlight.

(44m 59s)

> You’re right.

(44m 59s)

> Yeah.

(44m 59s)

> That’s the same thing we were discussing for, for editing, but you can record into it.

(45m 3s)

> So I would record into Fairlight with the AirPods Pro on my right ear so I could hear myself talking.

(45m 8s)

> Left ear to them.

(45m 9s)

> So they got garbage audio from an AirPod over an iPhone Skype call.

(45m 15s)

> And we would just have to pray that the iPad recorded properly everything.

(45m 21s)

> And then I would give them the origin file and they would replace my voice.

(45m 24s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, it’s similar to how I do it, except I’m using a Zoom H6 audio recorder that gets my good mic.

(45m 31s)

> And then, rather than AirPods, I’m just feeding your audio into the Zoom H6 to record that.

(45m 38s)

> And I can hear you from that as well.

(45m 39s) Wes Hilliard:

> Nice. Yeah.

(45m 41s) Tim Chaten:

> But yeah, you…

(45m 42s) Wes Hilliard:

> But even then you’re getting some compression cause we’re over the internet.

(45m 45s)

> So I will be giving you my local file, right? That’s,

(45m 45s) Tim Chaten:

> Right.

(45m 46s)

> Exactly.

(45m 47s)

> But you are hearing me from the iPad microphone, because there’s no really good way to do that.

(45m 48s) Wes Hilliard:

> and that’s what a lot of podcasters do.

(45m 53s)

> Well, yeah, well the, a microphone connected to the iPad.

(45m 55s)

> So I was still using a professional microphone, um,

(45m 58s)

> through the iPad pro back in the day and that, and that all worked fine. And I,

(46m 2s)

> and we never lost a recording. Um,

(46m 5s)

> every now and then something glitched and I would have to split a recording in

(46m 7s)

> but I never had any.

(46m 9s)

> anything disappear. Thankfully, um, we never had to re record audio, um,

(46m 13s)

> unless I just forgot to record it, but which is,

(46m 17s)

> which will always be a thing. But yeah,

(46m 19s)

> so what got me interested in a Mac and why I shifted was like that shift to

(46m 23s)

> Apple Silicon and universal control and it, and it worked two years of doing that

(46m 28s)

> worked fine, but the creep started setting in of, I just, I’m,

(46m 33s)

> I’m not using the iPad to its full potential. It’s become,

(46m 36s)

> It would be there next to the Mac and I would use apps.

(46m 39s)

> on it. I would still that it’s still my social media control center because I don’t you know, none of that was really on the on the Mac anyway, like there was still a lot to it, but I wasn’t doing my full job from it.

(46m 51s)

> I just and I was really starting to feel the Mac again.

(46m 54s)

> I was like, okay, all this polish on top of Mac OS is great. Universal control is great, but it’s still Mac OS.

(46m 59s)

> I’m still feeling like I’m being transported back in time.

(47m 2s)

> There’s all these weird things quirks.

(47m 4s)

> It feels like every app is kind of its own island.

(47m 7s)

> they’re not even aware of each other.

(47m 9s)

> The way they are on like iPadOS or iPhone, um, it, it, it just started feeling old again.

(47m 17s)

> And, and, uh, and Apple kind of just said, you know, here you go.

(47m 21s)

> And, you know, stage manager and stuff on Mac OS is fine, but just something about it just started to turn me off again from it.

(47m 27s)

> And I just really got started getting curious.

(47m 30s)

> Do I want to use the iPad again?

(47m 31s)

> And funny enough, while this was happening, this is the era when, you know, I’m sure all of us iPad obsessed people listen to the podcast.

(47m 39s)

> No, that this is about the time that everyone else got disillusioned from the iPad and kind of quit the iPad and did their like sad boy posts on the internet of I need to use the iPad the way it was meant to be used.

(47m 54s) Tim Chaten:

> Right. Was Stage Manager a thing at this point?

(47m 54s) Wes Hilliard:

> You know, John for he’s a Federico Vatici.

(47m 59s)

> So this is actually I stage manager was a thing.

(48m 3s)

> I used to Mac Apple announced stage manager external display support all of that and that was a very.

(48m 9s)

> busy summer, but I just stuck with the Mac because it was still kind of messy.

(48m 13s)

> And there was, yeah. And there, there was a vision there,

(48m 13s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, it’s pretty rough that

(48m 17s) Wes Hilliard:

> but it wasn’t complete.

(48m 18s)

> But iPadOS 17 is what where the switch happened.

(48m 23s)

> So I actually have only just recently switched back to being iPad only in August, but, um,

(48m 29s)

> and I mostly waited until the betas got stable and was sure that I could make it work. But yes, I’m pretty much back full iPad because of iPadOS 17,

(48m 37s)

> the stability of stage.

(48m 39s)

> manager, external monitor supports, perfect Thunderbolt supports, uh,

(48m 43s)

> good to go. Everything’s where it needs to be.

(48m 45s) Tim Chaten:

> Isn’t it great? I mean, it’s just, it’s just, it’s wild how good this is.

(48m 50s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah. Like we’re, we’re, we’re finally 90% of the way there. I’m,

(48m 55s)

> I’m missing so little. Uh, it’s, it’s frustrating at this point.

(48m 59s)

> What doesn’t work. And I really hope like,

(49m 3s)

> as everyone keeps wailing about podcasting,

(49m 6s)

> we might actually see something in iPadOS.

(49m 9s)

> 18 but but like

(49m 9s) Tim Chaten:

> I hope so, yeah. Because the initial external monitor support, you had the studio display,

(49m 16s)

> but it couldn’t see that camera that was on that display until this year.

(49m 20s) Wes Hilliard:

> Exactly, so there’s 45 minutes on my workflows and why, but I understand there was another reason you wanted to be on the show.

Game Streaming

(49m 30s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, so I saw you and Mastodon starting to share a bit about game streaming from the iPad and

(49m 38s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, so so iPadOS 17 did something else interesting which got me interested in trying the iPad again

(49m 47s)

> Game streaming well not even game streaming

(49m 49s)

> It was such an odd Announcement that even Apple should have known what it could be used for but they’re just like you can you can attach external webcams I’m like, okay, whatever moving on, you know next slide

(50m) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, who uses external webcams? That’s weird. Let’s go buy an iSight camera.

(50m 3s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah Yeah, and I was like okay cool. I can connect it to my studio display

(50m 8s)

> and now I get the webcam from the studio display.

(50m 10s)

> That’s all fine and dandy, but who cares?

(50m 12s)

> But because I wasn’t a heavy Mac user, a legacy user,

(50m 16s)

> it didn’t occur to me that this is how people record external video footage.

(50m 20s)

> UVC support is what it’s called.

(50m 25s)

> And when people started talking about it, I was like oh, neat.

(50m 28s)

> And Apple Insider was actually one of the first publications to get out a full overview of hooking up a capture card

(50m 38s)

> to a Switch to an iPad and using it as kind of a portable monitor for Nintendo Switch.

(50m 43s)

> That was the concept we were going for, but when I was writing that story,

(50m 46s)

> I was like, you can stream from this.

(50m 50s)

> And this was still in the beta days.

(50m 51s)

> This was still in the, there’s no real apps for this yet.

(50m 55s)

> So I knew it wasn’t possible at the moment, but it was coming.

(50m 59s)

> And when Camo Studio came out after iPad S17 released,

(51m 2s)

> it fell into place like okay, this is going to work.

(51m 6s)

> And then again.

(51m 8s)

> I’m going to do that too.

(51m 14s)

> He he ordered this streaming box, but he again, he ordered it because he wants to use the iPad as a monitor or, you know, for his, for his game.

(51m 25s)

> So that’s why he bought it.

(51m 26s)

> But then, um, but again, it clicked in my head streaming like and camo studio does have Twitch applications and it just, okay, I got to get this thing because the capture card

(51m 38s)

> was maybe $15 and it didn’t have a headphone jack.

(51m 42s)

> So I could get all the video piped into camo.

(51m 46s)

> I could get my head floating through the studio display webcam, no audio for me, nothing I could do because there’s no audio into control and in camo studio and other apps like it.

(51m 59s)

> And as you learned on a couple of episodes ago, I actually went back and listened to that.

(52m 4s)

> The last connected iPad The last

(52m 8s)

> video I will be showing you is the controlling audio device. You couldn’t simultaneously connect the streaming device and a microphone because it’s going to choose one or the other. So you’d either hear me talking and no game audio or game audio and me just miming away in the corner. Finally this answered it. Almost. So there was a lot of trial and error getting this set up. So again through the Thunderbolt, sorry,

(52m 38s)

> Thunderbolt dock, all of this actually still working. I didn’t actually have to do anything. I just plugged everything up through the streaming device, a USB-A cable to the dock because it doesn’t, it doesn’t need USB-C or Thunderbolt speeds to do this. Um, just one cable into the dock, bam, I’m in business, but I still couldn’t hear myself talk. AirPods Max is a digital to analog to digital to analog,

(53m 8s)

> device. It goes through two full conversions on the wire and an old school analog adapter has no idea what’s happening when you plug it in. So I went and got some headphones for my PlayStation. I can now hear myself, but I sound a thousand feet away because the microphone is being powered by the analog connection. And unless I was, I, so I took off the headphones and just like talked very loudly.

(53m 38s)

> Into the little hole in the side of the headphone and finally could hear myself through the video. I was like, that’s what it is. You need, I need a voice basically mod like analog voice modulated microphone, like actual analog microphone.

(53m 53s)

> So I went and got a headset from Best Buy because that’s what you do and hooked it up. I can now hear myself at a very low volume. Oh no, did I just waste my money? Do I have to return this headset? And then finally it kind of clicked to me.

(54m 8s)

> I need to update the software in this thing. I’ve never plugged it into a Mac. So I hooked it up to my Mac book, the streaming box. So I hooked it up to my Mac book. Yeah. So again, fun.

(54m 12s) Tim Chaten:

> Oh, the streaming, um, gotcha.

(54m 15s)

> Yeah.

(54m 20s) Wes Hilliard:

> This is the fun thing about Thunderbolt took the one cord out of my iPad, plug the one cord into my Mac book. Now my desk setup is my Mac, right? One cable. Love it. Didn’t have to do anything else.

(54m 32s)

> Seize the capture card. I download the software. It’s a full little studio and in.

(54m 38s)

> is audio controls so I could I turned down the levels of the video game turned up the levels of the microphone hit save hit update everything plugged it back into the iPad I now have full audio just no control but I can hear myself speak I can hear the video games in the in the background so annoyingly I needed Mac software to get it done again guys come on there’s there’s what’s there should be there should be two knobs for gain.

(55m 2s) Tim Chaten:

> There should be a little hardware knob for doing that on the capture card.

(55m 8s) Wes Hilliard:

> and an input control. A, B, iPadOS 17 introduced something that gosh what is it called it’s the thing where you can plug in an accessory and get a driver driver support yeah so driver kit is an iPadOS 17. Asus just make the app for iPad you can do it now it so again just the frustrations of being an iPad only user but long story short it works I hooked it up to Twitch with my two followers and I, uh, so.

(55m 38s)

> All in all again, to explain camo open on the studio display and four by three,

(55m 44s)

> I don’t know why, but the app does not extend to the full display camo.

(55m 48s)

> If you’re listening to this, please figure it out. Other apps do this.

(55m 52s)

> Third party apps do this. This is not an Apple limitation.

(55m 54s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, it’s not a, am I right that it’s not a resizable window, it’s kind of an old school

(56m) Wes Hilliard:

> No, well, it’s resizable, but all the sizes are four by three.

(56m 5s) Tim Chaten:

> Like the settings app, kind of.

(56m 5s) Wes Hilliard:

> So you’ve kind, well, yeah, kind of so, so certain.

(56m 9s) Tim Chaten:

> Okay.

(56m 10s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yes.

(56m 11s)

> Yeah.

(56m 11s)

> I think it’s settings that I’m not, I can’t do it.

(56m 13s)

> Cause I’m not on.

(56m 13s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, the settings app, it resizes at a very janky way.

(56m 17s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, it’s basically a square and there’s, and so if anyone who’s tried playing games on an external monitor with iPad might’ve run into this, there’s squares as well, like if you plug stardew valley into, from an iPad into a.

(56m 30s)

> Studio display, it will still be four by three.

(56m 32s) Tim Chaten:

> One thing you can do

(56m 32s) Wes Hilliard:

> Like a lot of games do this.

(56m 35s) Tim Chaten:

> PS remote play is a resizable window on an external monitor so you can actually play your ps5 on

(56m 38s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yes.

(56m 42s)

> Yeah.

(56m 42s)

> So that’s, that’s what I was getting at.

(56m 43s)

> Some apps actually utilize this.

(56m 45s)

> It’s it’s a, there’s, there’s a system for this and, and development.

(56m 49s)

> I don’t know how complicated it is.

(56m 51s)

> Maybe the app has to know how to redraw at that scale.

(56m 53s)

> And it’s going to require a lot of, uh, R and D to make sure that the app presents itself properly in 16 by nine.

(56m 59s)

> I don’t know, but please just make.

(57m)

> It happen anyway, so you open so I open camera studio on the studio display.

(57m 5s)

> Um, it, the main primary video is the capture card.

(57m 10s)

> So my Nintendo switch videos getting piped in secondary video source, studio display, webcam piping through the Thunderbolt connection to the iPad.

(57m 20s)

> So cool.

(57m 20s)

> So, and it can zoom in, crop out the background and it’s just my floating

(57m 26s)

> head and shoulders and I put that and I can put it wherever I want to.

(57m 30s)

> in the camo studio, drag it into the corner, shrink it down.

(57m 33s)

> So I’m not too big audio intent. This is the fun one.

(57m 37s)

> Do you want your iPad studio display streaming box?

(57m 43s)

> Uh, as your options. Oh, but the streaming box is great out. Can’t select it.

(57m 47s)

> So, so here’s what you do.

(57m 51s)

> Unplug the cable from the iPad, plug it back in.

(57m 54s)

> Suddenly the last thing connected is the streaming box.

(57m 56s)

> you can now select it as your audio intent.

(57m 59s)

> The…

(58m)

> It even sees it in the selection menu, which is great out, but anyway, so now

(58m 6s)

> Everything’s set up as it needs to be. Click a recording button so my session can be recorded to photos or files

(58m 14s)

> Click stream to Twitch

(58m 17s)

> BAM. I am now streaming to Twitch I’m now having a local recording saved if maybe I want to edit it and upload it to YouTube. Two external video sources I’m talking through a microphone on my headset I can hear all of my audio on the headset.

(58m 30s)

> Everything’s working perfectly and I still have my iPad Pro on the side.

(58m 35s)

> I open Twitch on that iPad Pro and I can now see my chat.

(58m 40s)

> I can see, you know, the reactions of people coming in, yada yada.

(58m 45s)

> And my iPad Mini gets a use case here too.

(58m 48s)

> I open Twitch on it as well, but to the public feed,

(58m 51s)

> so I can see my own stream and see that it’s coming through correctly.

(58m 56s)

> And yeah, so I’ve basically backed myself into it.

(59m)

> And I’m going to an actually good streaming setup, funny enough, on the iPad, completely run from it alone.

(59m 7s) Tim Chaten:

> And to play the games, are you looking at the Camo Studio window, or the Switch? Are you hand-holding the Switch in some way?

(59m 15s) Wes Hilliard:

> So when this I didn’t actually mention this it’s coming through the switch dock. So I have a

(59m 22s)

> Genki switch dock mini that that’s basically a little outlet and when you plug into a switch dock the switch screen goes off

(59m 31s)

> This actually is lagless

(59m 34s)

> Well, whatever millisecond someone someone will tell me it’s a 1.4 millisecond lag or something

(59m 40s)

> It’s imperceptible, but you go through to yeah, I’m viewing it. That’s why I really want them to make it full screen support on camo so I can use the full 16 by 9 display to play my Nintendo Switch. But yes, I am viewing the studio display to play the game.

(59m 56s)

> The iPad mini stream is actually about 10, maybe 8 to 10 seconds behind so I can glance down every now and then see what I was doing a second ago, but see it coming in at full, you know,

(1h 5s)

> 30 frames and it’s like, great, everything’s working as it should be. Like, it’s perfect.

(1h 10s)

> I’m excited about it.

(1h 12s)

> I’m not a streamer.

(1h 13s)

> Look, I have two followers.

(1h 15s)

> I, I don’t know that I’m actually going to really do anything with this.

(1h 17s)

> I just wanted to see that it was possible.

(1h 19s)

> And I’ve been thinking of plans of how can I utilize this?

(1h 23s)

> Cause I spent the money.

(1h 24s)

> I took the time.

(1h 25s)

> I don’t know.

(1h 26s)

> I, maybe I just might start streaming for fun.

(1h 28s)

> If people want to follow me, I’m Hilly tech everywhere.

(1h 31s)

> Go Twitch.

(1h 32s)

> You’ll just slash Hilly tech.

(1h 33s)

> It’s fine.

(1h 34s)

> Massadon same thing.

(1h 35s)

> Uh, I’m, but I’m on tech hub dot social, but like Hilly tech everywhere.

(1h 40s)

> And I’m going to post on massadon mostly when I’m streaming.

(1h 45s)

> If anyone wants to come check it out, give me some encouragement in the chat.

(1h 48s)

> I would very much appreciate it, but I don’t know.

(1h 50s)

> Maybe I’ll play some games.

(1h 52s)

> I kind of have a concept.

(1h 53s)

> If anyone would be interested in this, uh, just to pitch it on the show, maybe I might go every Friday cause I don’t, I work actually, uh, funny enough on Monday through Thursday schedule because somehow I figured that out.

(1h 1m 6s)

> Um, Fridays I’m thinking I might go and play the Apple arcade game of the week

(1h 1m 10s)

> on the stream and discuss it, you know, like through the iPad and everything.

(1h 1m 15s)

> Running some concepts through my head, but I am by no means a streamer.

(1h 1m 18s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I mean you could even use that set up to hook up your iPhone to camo and stream your iPhone doing something if you wanted

(1h 1m 25s) Wes Hilliard:

> Absolutely. Or I could hook up, you know,

(1h 1m 28s)

> a compatible DSLR and record myself setting up shortcuts on an iPad on my desk.

(1h 1m 34s) Tim Chaten:

> Totally, yep.

(1h 1m 34s) Wes Hilliard:

> Right. Like there’s, there’s a thousand ways to utilize this. Um,

(1h 1m 39s)

> I just need to figure it out more or less.

(1h 1m 40s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, you should do like a Jackbox party day where people are throwing, playing along.

(1h 1m 46s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah. Yeah. Like there’s, there’s, there’s, there’s ways to do this and it,

(1h 1m 49s)

> it can be a lot of fun. I, but again, like I’m so busy as it is,

(1h 1m 53s)

> Do I really need 15 more things to do?

(1h 1m 54s) Tim Chaten:

> Right

(1h 1m 55s) Wes Hilliard:

> I have a Playstation 5, but I haven’t used it to stream, but luckily it’s pretty simple to move.

(1h 1m 57s) Tim Chaten:

> Is your you have a ps5 you mentioned

(1h 2m 2s)

> Is it okay, I’d imagine it’s in a different room it’s not on your desk

(1h 2m 25s) Wes Hilliard:

> It takes 2 seconds to unplug 2 cables and plug 2 in, I can do that.

(1h 2m 31s) Tim Chaten:

> I mean, you could always just use the PS2 Remote Play app to stream that, I guess.

(1h 2m 35s)

> That might not be great.

(1h 2m 37s)

> For the lag, right?

(1h 2m 39s)

> Yeah.

(1h 2m 44s)

> Right.

(1h 2m 45s) Wes Hilliard:

> Now what I won’t stream probably is PSVR with me walking around with a headset on.

(1h 2m 48s) Tim Chaten:

> No…

(1h 2m 50s)

> I mean, that would be entertaining. There are streamers that do that.

(1h 2m 53s)

> I’m not sure how well the iPad would… I guess it would handle it fine.

(1h 2m 57s)

> Um…

(1h 2m 57s) Wes Hilliard:

> It would, it would handle it because it’s still an HDMI connection.

(1h 2m 59s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, yeah.

(1h 2m 59s) Wes Hilliard:

> I’m more worried about me punching my monitor.

(1h 3m 2s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, that’s something you need to…

(1h 3m 2s) Wes Hilliard:

> So I’d have to put up a piece of plexiglass or something,

(1h 3m 7s) Tim Chaten:

> Exactly. Yeah.

(1h 3m 9s)

> Edit.

(1h 3m 10s) Wes Hilliard:

> but yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s exciting.

(1h 3m 13s)

> Cause again, we didn’t just like even a year ago, six months ago,

(1h 3m 17s)

> this was impossible.

(1h 3m 18s)

> And now you can introduce this concept to a whole new group.

(1h 3m 25s)

> Like a lot of kids say, like.

(1h 3m 27s)

> Have iPads, you know, the younger generation I have, I have a, a nephew who would be interested in streaming who has an iPad.

(1h 3m 35s)

> And it’s like, man, all you need now is a USB compatible hub.

(1h 3m 40s)

> That’s like 20 bucks and a microphone, and you can get on to camo studio and plug in your switch and just go.

(1h 3m 48s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I think my hookup for my Switch, it was less than 50 bucks for the capture card thing and the dock for my iPad and all that.

(1h 3m 58s) Wes Hilliard:

> There’s actually even cheaper. So nowadays the mini-docs are 20 bucks and it’s

(1h 4m 2s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah. Oh, nice. Yeah, I bought this cable thing. It’s just a cable that plugs in for my Switch to the iPad. Yeah.

(1h 4m 10s) Wes Hilliard:

> yeah this thing’s kind of a more of a boxy dongle that has an hdmi port in it and a usb out

(1h 4m 16s)

> like and it’s it’s $20 the capture card that does 1080p which is all the switches anyway 20 bucks

(1h 4m 23s)

> Like, you could have a fully fledged streaming system for a 10%…

(1h 4m 28s)

> .9 inch iPad for less than $50.

(1h 4m 32s)

> And like, that’s, that’s exciting to me. That’s, that’s really cool to me that,

(1h 4m 36s)

> again, this is just another barrier drop for the iPad as a computer community.

(1h 4m 41s) Tim Chaten:

> I really wish the switch, the next switch, would be able to use a dock without AC power in some way.

(1h 4m 49s)

> That is the most annoying part of it.

(1h 4m 52s) Wes Hilliard:

> So this is a fun thing.

(1h 4m 54s)

> So I actually figured out if you get this, one of these switch mini docks that I was talking about, they’re, they’re cheap, but they work.

(1h 5m 2s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah

(1h 5m 3s) Wes Hilliard:

> They’re the power out option is USB-C.

(1h 5m 7s)

> So just plug it into a battery and now it’s fully portable.

(1h 5m 11s) Tim Chaten:

> That’s awesome

(1h 5m 12s) Wes Hilliard:

> You don’t need an AC outlet.

(1h 5m 13s)

> Yeah.

(1h 5m 14s)

> Cause Federico Vatici was going through this.

(1h 5m 17s)

> He bought a AC battery when it like, you know, a portable battery,

(1h 5m 22s)

> you charge your iPhone with, so it’s not huge, but it had an AC outlet on it

(1h 5m 26s)

> in order for him to run his Nintendo switch dock.

(1h 5m 28s)

> And it’s just like, I messaged him.

(1h 5m 30s)

> I was like, dude, no, like you go get this thing.

(1h 5m 32s)

> You all you need is a USB battery.

(1h 5m 35s)

> And, uh, but yeah, it works.

(1h 5m 36s)

> It’s it’s, it’s totally doable.

(1h 5m 38s)

> You could set up a portable rig to make your iPad and external monitor for very cheap or create a streaming setup for very cheap.

(1h 5m 45s)

> It’s all actually getting very easy these.

(1h 5m 48s) Tim Chaten:

> Nice, yeah. Yeah, I played around with using the switch, um, with using the iPad just as a monitor for my switch and that seemed a bit silly to me because the aspect ratio difference and I have no OLED switch like it’s it seems like I’d rather just handhold the switch.

(1h 6m 6s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, I mean, I’m using it to get it on my studio display, but again, like no, no app actually does this yet.

(1h 6m 15s)

> And 16 by nine, I tried the Orion app, and I can’t use it.

(1h 6m 20s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, that thing’s pretty neat, right?

(1h 6m 23s)

> Oh, ’cause that’s just for the iPad screen.

(1h 6m 26s) Wes Hilliard:

> I think for some reason, it’s limited to the iPad.

(1h 6m 28s)

> And I and I told I messaged the Halide team and I was like, guys, Camo does this like There’s got to be a way to make this work.

(1h 6m 36s)

> through a dock and through to an external monitor and they’re just like we’ll look into it but um yeah like they’re

(1h 6m 40s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, that app is very skew-

(1h 6m 45s) Wes Hilliard:

> yeah it’s a it’s a silly it’s a project that they did and now they’re focused on their video video app um that they just announced yesterday as we record

(1h 6m 54s)

> um so yeah that’s probably not going to happen but I someone will step in and make this work on a 69 by 9 external display as far as using it that way but I don’t think anyone’s going to beat camo at the utility.

(1h 7m 6s)

> of the game.

(1h 7m 32s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, game streaming is such a weird thing because I’ve tried it in the past back when PS4 built it into the console And I found myself not enjoying games as much at times like your per-

(1h 7m 41s) Wes Hilliard:

> It’s hard. I tried playing Mario. So so my streaming experience so far. It’s been kind of funny. So I played Mario wonder and

(1h 7m 48s)

> I discovered very quickly that that game is very difficult to sweat to

(1h 7m 55s)

> Stream. Sorry that game is very difficult to stream because I

(1h 8m)

> See a follower come in and I there’s if there’s no one if there’s no one there

(1h 8m 5s)

> I’m not gonna just talk to myself Maybe I should because because because I started realizing like if no one’s

(1h 8m 11s)

> here to hear me and I’m not talking and someone comes in and I’m not talking,

(1h 8m 15s)

> then are they going to leave because I’m not,

(1h 8m 17s)

> so do I need to just have a constant stream of consciousness going or you know,

(1h 8m 22s)

> or if I do see someone come into the thing, so I,

(1h 8m 24s)

> I one time I had like two or three people and that was fine, whatever. Again,

(1h 8m 27s)

> I don’t care. I’m not a professional. I just toying around. Um, and you know,

(1h 8m 31s)

> I’d start talking to me like, Hey, this is what I’m doing. Um, you know,

(1h 8m 33s)

> this is hooked up through an iPad and stuff. And uh,

(1h 8m 36s)

> they’re probably just bots because no one responded. But, um, yeah,

(1h 8m 40s)

> As soon as I started talking or paying attention,

(1h 8m 41s)

> to the fact that there were people in the room,

(1h 8m 43s)

> I started dying very quickly, because it’s just…

(1h 8m 45s) Tim Chaten:

> Gotta play as Yoshi, you know.

(1h 8m 47s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, right.

(1h 8m 48s)

> But it’s just like I…

(1h 8m 49s)

> My consciousness…

(1h 8m 51s)

> Yeah, like…

(1h 8m 52s)

> Yeah, now I’m splitting my attention.

(1h 8m 55s)

> So yeah, it’s like streaming is actually very difficult.

(1h 8m 57s)

> So I switched to Pokemon so I can just smash A and, you know,

(1h 9m)

> and keep moving.

(1h 9m 1s)

> But, again, it’s an interesting concept,

(1h 9m 4s)

> and just another thing that I want to experiment with now,

(1h 9m 6s)

> just because it’s possible that on iPad and…

(1h 9m 11s)

> It’s funny that all Apple has to do is add a software feature and introduce an entire new industry to a product.

(1h 9m 17s)

> Like, it’s just funny to me how that works.

(1h 9m 20s) Tim Chaten:

> It is pretty cool. I’ve yet to see, I don’t know, like would Camo be a tool that you could offload VHS tapes to your iPad in a good quality way? Or does a different app need to be created for that kind of bespoke purpose?

(1h 9m 35s) Wes Hilliard:

> I don’t know. Well, I mean, anything that pipes in the thing and lets you hit the record button should do it fine.

(1h 9m 42s)

> The limitation there, of course, is you’re going through a… you’d have to get an analog, basically the white, yellow, red cable to HDMI to make this work.

(1h 9m 53s)

> Or you’d have to specifically get a capture card that converts that analog signal and has an input.

(1h 9m 57s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, Elgato used to sell this thing from the Mac, it was USB to the old school things for this exact thing, but I think it’s probably proprietary.

(1h 10m 6s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah

(1h 10m 10s)

> It’s yeah, there’s there’s gonna be some limitations there But I mean there’s better tools for that and honestly like unless unless it’s home video. I wouldn’t worry about it

(1h 10m 20s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, yeah, that’s the use case right home video, yep.

(1h 10m 20s) Wes Hilliard:

> Just just go just go buy Conair for $4 on iTunes

(1h 10m 23s) Tim Chaten:

> Exactly.

(1h 10m 25s) Wes Hilliard:

> no, but It does have its applications and its uses and I like and again people are so clever they just figure out new ways to do things with stuff that like I just wouldn’t even conceptualize.

(1h 10m 36s)

> myself but like in if the streaming thing if I can get more than five people to watch me or whatever I’m interested in hooking up my analog pocket and playing Pokemon yellow you know you know because you just you can output HDMI from the analog pocket through the dock you can buy Nintendo 64 conversion kits to convert them to HDMI and analogs actually coming out with a Nintendo 64 model and early next year to be able to play the game.

(1h 11m 6s)

> play cartridges on and I have quite the cartridge collection so I’m like yep.

(1h 11m 6s) Tim Chaten:

> tempted. Yeah, that’s the one console I’ve been collecting. It’s like, this is a manageable console to get every game for because there’s only like, I don’t know.

(1h 11m 16s) Wes Hilliard:

> And it’s like $4 for Rugrats in Paris. I’m like, all right, I’ll go buy that. That’s fine.

(1h 11m 19s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, there’s not that many games on N64. There’s like, what, 200 to 300 games in total? I forget.

(1h 11m 26s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, it’s not, it’s not bad. I don’t, I’m not one who’s buying all of them. I’m just buying the ones I played when I was nine, so I can, you know, have them, but, uh, you know, Turok,

(1h 11m 29s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah.

(1h 11m 34s) Wes Hilliard:

> oh man, look at all this fog. But, um, yeah, like it’s great. It’s so, it’s so fun to be nostalgic that way, but it would be fun to, uh, you know, stream that. So again, I’m just kind of conceptualizing ways I can implement.

(1h 11m 46s)

> That bring my hobbies into streaming because it’s it’s easy to do but

(1h 11m 51s) Tim Chaten:

> But it is wild how this one feature that Apple added was like, “Oh, this means all these other apps could come.”

(1h 11m 58s)

> Because I’ve been asking for years for HDI input support, and we got it basically.

(1h 12m 4s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, well, so that, that brings us to our, our next kind of topic, I guess.

What would we change about iPad?

(1h 12m 9s) Wes Hilliard:

> And that’s what would we change about the iPad or bring to the iPad?

(1h 12m 13s)

> Right.

(1h 12m 13s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I mean the audio, the audio is the obvious.

(1h 12m 14s) Wes Hilliard:

> Like, so yeah, yeah.

(1h 12m 19s)

> Audio intense is, is huge.

(1h 12m 21s)

> Um, clipboard managers.

(1h 12m 23s)

> I think Apple needs to open the door to system wide control systems.

(1h 12m 28s)

> Like, um, like, like clipboard managers, you know, they’re kind of doing it.

(1h 12m 32s)

> They’re showing signs.

(1h 12m 34s)

> That they’re interested in these kinds of things with like password managers,

(1h 12m 37s)

> because you can implement one password across the system,

(1h 12m 40s)

> anywhere an autofill is available.

(1h 12m 43s)

> Um, just do that with clipboard and make it private and make it accessible.

(1h 12m 49s)

> And, uh, again, audio tents, make it private, make it accessible.

(1h 12m 54s)

> Give us a control panel control center already tells you good and gives you options to control the audio and video.

(1h 13m 1s)

> It’s it’s like we’re a quarter step.

(1h 13m 4s)

> Away, it doesn’t even make sense why it’s not even there yet, because it’s like they forgot to toggle it.

(1h 13m 8s)

> There’s like a button they forgot to press before they hit launch.

(1h 13m 11s)

> Um, we’re so close, like we’re even closer than like, say in 2019 when everyone was like, Oh, all they got to do is this.

(1h 13m 17s)

> It’s like, no, like now my goodness, they’ve done everything.

(1h 13m 21s)

> They just haven’t turned on the feature.

(1h 13m 23s)

> I would like, but I would like to just see stuff like that get better.

(1h 13m 27s)

> Like apps.

(1h 13m 28s)

> Like I said, I want, I want like Pixelmator pro to just come to I’ve had, please guys, just,

(1h 13m 34s)

> do it photo meters.

(1h 13m 35s)

> Good.

(1h 13m 36s)

> So, so anyone listening who’s curious, the difference between photo mater and Pixelmator pro Pixelmator pro is a vector editing, like photo application where you can drop in shapes and images on top of each other and layer it and then export it.

(1h 13m 52s) Tim Chaten:

> Okay, Affinity Designer kind of toolset.

(1h 13m 55s) Wes Hilliard:

> Right.

(1h 13m 56s)

> But it’s also a photo editor with color saturation cropping.

(1h 14m)

> It’s it’s all so Pixelmator Pro is actually an all.

(1h 14m 4s)

> One tool.

(1h 14m 4s)

> Whereas right now I’m using Photomator to do ML super resolution to double the size of an image and export it as a PNG pasted into design affinity to designer

(1h 14m 16s)

> in order to do my vector images.

(1h 14m 20s)

> It doesn’t need to be a two-step system guys.

(1h 14m 22s)

> Just make it like and photo Photomator is actually not that many features away from being Pixelmator Pro.

(1h 14m 28s)

> I just don’t know why they they’re keeping the distinction or what they’re doing here.

(1h 14m 32s)

> but I hope there’s plans to.

(1h 14m 34s)

> that happen.

(1h 14m 48s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, definitely. Yeah, and as far as missing apps, I bring it up every now and then as RapidWeaver.

(1h 14m 54s)

> I’d love to see RapidWeaver come to the iPad. That’s my one app I very much miss from the Mac.

(1h 14m 59s) Wes Hilliard:

> like a web development what’s that for yeah okay yeah nice yeah I want and this this is a different conversation I want a GameCube emulator you know like yeah I dolphin does work I

(1h 15m 1s) Tim Chaten:

> What’s that? Web development. It’s basically iWeb Pro back in the day,

(1h 15m 8s)

> and it’s still an active development for the Mac.

(1h 15m 18s)

> There is that Dolphin thing if you, uh, if you, you can, what, you need to like hack the app store thing.

(1h 15m 25s)

> That’s the thing, like when the app store opens up in Europe, maybe we find a way to get some of these apps.

(1h 15m 31s) Wes Hilliard:

> It’s tricky. I’m a collector so I’m not afraid to say I’m not stealing because I own these games and I want to play them in different places.

(1h 15m 38s)

> So, you know, get back to me on that. Like, I don’t, I do…

(1h 15m 40s) Tim Chaten:

> But the GameCube is such a perfect fit for IPEX’s 4×3.

(1h 15m 44s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, so like, it would be such a good system and it can upscale to 4K and AltStore is fine. I know how to do it.

(1h 15m 50s)

> I even have a Mac sitting here. I could just do AltStore, but I just haven’t.

(1h 15m 52s) Tim Chaten:

> It’s just a pain in the butt, I mean.

(1h 15m 53s) Wes Hilliard:

> It’s just, it’s a lot. But, like, it would be just so cool if Nintendo, man, just, money. Money, money, money, just…

(1h 15m 54s) Tim Chaten:

[laughs]

(1h 16m 1s) Wes Hilliard:

> Build an emulator yourself. It’s officially licensed and sell it. Yeah, and sell, or yeah, just make Nintendo Online available to stream to iPad.

(1h 16m 2s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, Nintendo online account, right?

(1h 16m 9s) Wes Hilliard:

> But, like, stuff like that would just be really cool because at this point, it’s hard for me to think what’s missing other than, like, the two things I mentioned before.

(1h 16m 18s)

> Because it’s, the iPad’s such a comfortable, perfect device for me. It just fits my workflows. It does what I need it to do.

(1h 16m 25s)

> I don’t have, people will say, “Well, you’re going through so many workarounds to get this done.”

(1h 16m 31s)

> “Why not just use a Mac?” I don’t really even consider them workarounds. This is just how you use the system.

(1h 16m 35s)

> You set up shortcuts. You download these extra apps to use them as extensions in your workflow.

(1h 16m 42s)

> Like, how is that any different, really, than going on a Mac and downloading all these different control options and all these different menu bar apps?

(1h 16m 50s)

> Like, I don’t see it as any different.

(1h 16m 50s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I used to, my Mac days, use Quicksilver as an add-on to the Mac system in a similar way that

(1h 16m 58s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah. Like it’s, it’s, it’s funny to me that people are like,

(1h 17m)

> you’re going through all these, you know, loops to use an iPad.

(1h 17m 4s)

> I’m like, you have to do all this setup on Mac too. It’s just different setup,

(1h 17m 8s)

> but it’s still,

(1h 17m 9s)

> you’re still going through every menu and everything and checking the boxes and making sure it all communicates the way you want exports, the way you want,

(1h 17m 17s)

> works the way you want. I’m just doing it on an iPad in a different way.

(1h 17m 21s)

> And some of it can be a little convoluted,

(1h 17m 23s)

> but it’s getting less so as time goes on.

(1h 17m 25s)

> And I just wonder what Apple’s plan is for this.

(1h 17m 28s)

> Platform because it sounds like 2024 is going to be an exciting time for iPad users.

Apple Vision Pro

(1h 17m 33s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, and I guess one of my final questions is, you mentioned you have PSVR2, I believe.

(1h 17m 43s)

> So headsets are not scary to you.

(1h 17m 45s)

> Is the price tag of Apple Vision Pro scaring you off, or is that something you’re excited

(1h 17m 52s) Wes Hilliard:

> Well, so Apple Vision Pro is in my future, um, I’m interested in it for multiple reasons.

(1h 17m 59s)

> One, I want to be able to talk about it like I’m on a podcast, you know, Apple Insider is kind of a general news tech podcast and I don’t want to be a, well, John Syracuse has said this, right?

(1h 18m 10s)

> I want to have, like, I want to be able to say my real world experiences and share using this device and Apple Vision Pro, funny enough, is an extension of iPad Pro.

(1h 18m 22s)

> It’s not like, like we’re evolving the ecosystem of iPadOS, the apps in the app store, the interaction paradigms to Vision Pro.

(1h 18m 33s)

> This is just an evolution of how everything built for iPad coming to AR and VR.

(1h 18m 40s)

> So I think it’s the perfect extension of this system.

(1h 18m 43s)

> And I don’t know how it fits in with the iPad going forward.

(1h 18m 46s)

> I don’t, I would know.

(1h 18m 47s)

> I don’t think as of right now it would replace an iPad.

(1h 18m 52s)

> I would still want to take my iPad to some hotel or someone else’s house and work from it.

(1h 18m 59s)

> Right.

(1h 19m)

> I’m not going to do that on Vision Pro.

(1h 19m 1s)

> But Vision Pro would definitely be like an excellent, I’m in my office, I’m going to open up all these windows and heck, even my iPad Pro sitting here can run a window inside Vision Pro.

(1h 19m 11s)

> Like it’s definitely an interesting concept to me.

(1h 19m 13s)

> The price makes sense.

(1h 19m 16s)

> It’s a lot and it’s kind of within my budget.

(1h 19m 20s)

> We’ll have to see when it comes out.

(1h 19m 22s)

> Um, it’s just, I, I can’t help, but think this is for me, the first Apple device.

(1h 19m 30s)

> That is a new paradigm shift, a new operating system, a new interaction

(1h 19m 36s)

> thing, uh, coming out while I’m working this beat as an Apple reporter.

(1h 19m 41s)

> And I kind of, I, you know, you listen to like Joanna Stern or, uh, John, uh,

(1h 19m 46s)

> Gruber talk about when the iPhone was announced because they were reporting at the time and how.

(1h 19m 52s)

> How do you feel about that?

(1h 20m 11s) Tim Chaten:

> For sure. And yeah, as you said, it’s kind of like

(1h 20m 15s)

> iPad users are the most perfect users of this new platform because I’d say we’re more flexible

(1h 20m 20s)

> computer users than the Mac people that are a little stuck in their ways.

(1h 20m 23s) Wes Hilliard:

> We’re trained for it.

(1h 20m 25s)

> We’re trained for this.

(1h 20m 26s)

> All of the workflows that we’ve built for iPad, the shortcuts, the apps,

(1h 20m 30s)

> everything, translates directly to Vision Pro.

(1h 20m 33s)

> It’s not like we have to go to Vision Pro and come up with new workarounds.

(1h 20m 36s)

> Everything we’ve done for iPad is what’s going to work on Vision Pro.

(1h 20m 41s)

> And the Mac users, I can already hear it now,

(1h 20m 44s)

> are going to be the ones saying you can’t work from Vision Pro because they’re the ones who are using these terminal commands and complex.

(1h 20m 53s)

> I’m not saying I can’t reproduce my work on Vision Pro because I’m used to all of these complex systems, but anyone who’s worked from iPad who already has everything their workflows put together for iPad will have no problem on

(1h 21m 12s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, it’ll be like, I don’t know, like the iPad will become like my laptop and the Vision Pro is my like

(1h 21m 19s) Wes Hilliard:

> Desktop, you know, that’s kind of the way I see it.

(1h 21m 19s) Tim Chaten:

> Desktop. Yeah more expansive environment. Yeah

(1h 21m 24s) Wes Hilliard:

> What does that mean though?

(1h 21m 25s)

> Like, do I get rid of my studio display and just have like an empty desk to work from?

(1h 21m 30s)

> Minority Report style, just sit down and open up all these screens.

(1h 21m 32s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, the whole desk setup.

(1h 21m 36s) Wes Hilliard:

> Here’s a picture of my desk setup and it’s just an empty desk, you know.

(1h 21m 40s) Tim Chaten:

> [laughs] It’s like you have a pen and paper there.

(1h 21m 45s) Wes Hilliard:

> it’ll it’s going to be a thing and i’m

(1h 21m 49s)

> i’m only going to sell out of their store initially I think um I won’t be able to yeah

(1h 22m 4s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I’ll be curious how they do this, ’cause I wanna order one on day one.

(1h 22m 7s)

> I don’t know if that means it’s gonna make me go to a store to fit it, or if I’ll be able to do it online.

(1h 22m 13s) Wes Hilliard:

> I think at least the first batch is going to be in-store pickup only because they don’t want to send it straight to someone’s home and then break it trying to set it up, right?

(1h 22m 25s)

> This is different from Apple Watch. This is different from iPhone or iPad. It requires a lot of setup. It requires prescription glasses for some people.

(1h 22m 34s)

> Apple even said in their last earnings call, which is another reason why listening to these can sometimes be helpful, they said,

(1h 22m 43s)

> Vision Pro is an Apple Store experience. So maybe they’ll allow things like Best Buy to do it because Best Buy has those little Apple alcoves or whatever.

(1h 22m 54s)

> So that’s where I want to buy it because I happen to have a stupid Best Buy credit card and I was like, “I’ll just put it on there.”

(1h 23m 1s)

> You know, “Hey, I have two years of interest-free payments. Why not? I can do it.”

(1h 23m 5s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, I was always curious, the Apple Card, will they give us 24 months or the standard 12?

(1h 23m 13s) Wes Hilliard:

> There’s other problems that we don’t have time for at Goldman Sachs, but my Apple Card is actually the center pillar of my financial system.

(1h 23m 22s)

> I use it as a Samus Cash card. I pay it off at the end of each month. I never accrue interest. I’ve actually never had one interest payment on it, thankfully, but I use it for everything.

(1h 23m 32s)

> And if I put a Vision Pro on there, I’m not going to have that much. I don’t want to erase all of my overhead for my Samus Cash card.

(1h 23m 43s)

> It’s just so I can have a payment plan on Vision Pro, right? So it’s messy, but again, we’ll just have to see when we get there.

(1h 23m 50s)

> I hope that maybe in the future I can come back on Vision Pros and talk about Apple Vision Pro and get into it.

(1h 23m 59s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, that’ll be great. I’m so curious about early next year and what this will look like for the rollout and how incredibly difficult this item will be to actually purchase, probably, because of the scarcity.

(1h 24m 12s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, it might actually be hard to actually get the first copy or whatever and are people going to be hawking these on eBay for $20,000?

(1h 24m 21s) Tim Chaten:

> Whew, yeah, we’ll see. Yeah, shoot.

What industry should Apple disrupt next?

(1h 24m 23s) Wes Hilliard:

> So I have one question for you, I don’t know how long you normally have these run

(1h 24m 28s)

> So What do you think what industry does Apple need to disrupt next?

(1h 24m 33s)

> What products do they need to release and I’ll give you my example that just to help you along the question

(1h 24m 39s)

> We need routers again. I need an

(1h 24m 42s)

> Apple Mesh Network again that incorporates Apple TVs, Home Pods, and like a central node like an airport router that that communicates to all these things and just extends and amplifies my Wi-Fi network. All controlled by Apple. HomeKit router support. The whole nine yards. Apple could really kill it. I wish they would get back into the router game. What about you?

(1h 25m 3s) Tim Chaten:

> I mean, I miss the routers deeply. I have the one home kit links this router, and it’s not great.

(1h 25m 9s)

[laughs]

(1h 25m 9s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, no. Linksys, everyone’s given up on that. I had a Mastodon post about this recently because it kind of jumped into my head. It’s like, “Whatever happened to HomeKit routers?” Because I bought a Linksys router that they said they were updating with HomeKit support. Never did.

(1h 25m 11s) Tim Chaten:

[laughs]

(1h 25m 24s)

> Yeah, it’s the MX4200 or something I have here. I’ve got and I got one for my desk down here

(1h 25m 27s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yep.

(1h 25m 31s) Tim Chaten:

> because The mesh networking is actually really amazing to me. I have my PS5

(1h 25m 35s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, it’s awesome.

(1h 25m 37s) Tim Chaten:

> Plugged over ethernet to it and that it’s magical like I can remote play like

(1h 25m 44s)

> States away and have a good experience with that wired connection to this wireless router. I don’t know how it does that but

(1h 25m 51s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, no, it’s it’s the mesh networking is great and I have two Linksys routers One of them is the HomeKit compatible one and one of them is Wi-Fi 6 the step above

(1h 26m 2s)

> the base because the 4200 that does HomeKit is actually kind of their base offering which is like $200 and and then I have the I

(1h 26m 11s)

> Forget 5000 series Wi-Fi 6 router that they offer. That’s like $300

(1h 26m 16s)

> It doesn’t then it doesn’t let you do HomeKit So I would actually have to replace that one.

(1h 26m 21s)

> And with the 42, so I would have two 4200s and then I could do a home kit,

(1h 26m 25s)

> but it’s not worth it because they’re wifi six. And I looked into it and is,

(1h 26m 30s)

> um, Eero has a statement on their website.

(1h 26m 32s)

> They have no intention of implementing home kit router support and their future routers. So, uh, link says, says just no,

(1h 26m 39s)

> we’re not doing it anymore.

(1h 26m 41s)

> There’s no modern router company actually bothering with home kit router support.

(1h 26m 46s)

> And I’m just like, is this just going to be dead now?

(1h 26m 48s)

> Like Wi-Fi seven’s coming next year.

(1h 26m 51s)

> Like, can none of us upgrade who have home kit routers to a new system?

(1h 26m 55s)

> Like what happened here?

(1h 26m 56s)

> Why is the ball being dropped?

(1h 26m 57s)

> But again, Apple just step in and fix it.

(1h 27m) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, so my answer would probably be printers. I’ve hated every printer we we’ve gotten

(1h 27m) Wes Hilliard:

> Make, make a new router.

(1h 27m 7s) Tim Chaten:

> No one seems to make a nice Apple II printer

(1h 27m 13s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah. HP. Oh,

(1h 27m 13s) Tim Chaten:

> In an aperture should come back aperture should be a thing it should be on iPad as well as the

(1h 27m 20s) Wes Hilliard:

> a professional Apple photo editor. That’s a monthly subscription.

(1h 27m 24s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, you could pair with a photo printer even, you know, from Apple.

(1h 27m 28s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah. Right. Right. No Aputure. I loved Aputure. Um,

(1h 27m 31s)

> I had a Mac book back when that was still a thing and man. Yeah, I agree. Uh,

(1h 27m 36s)

> like I I’m happy that we have dark room. Um, I actually, uh,

(1h 27m 40s)

> started using PhotoMator exclusively instead of.

(1h 27m 43s)

> I was using Darkroom for certain things and PhotoMator for other things.

(1h 27m 46s)

> And Darkroom has a lot of great filters, but I started just using PhotoMator mostly.

(1h 27m 50s)

> But yeah, there’s a lot of great options out there, but something about Aputure just really kind of, it being Apple’s thing, just kind of made it nice.

(1h 27m 56s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah. For sure. Yeah. And yeah, Photomator is my favorite. The user interface just speaks

(1h 28m 4s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, and they’re super resolution and their D noise systems are really good. They’re very smart. Yeah, I

(1h 28m 8s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, for sure well anything else we haven’t covered they’d like to before we wrap it up

Where can people follow you online?

(1h 28m 13s) Wes Hilliard:

> Just want to mourn the loss of Twitter and

(1h 28m 17s)

> the No, it just makes me sad. It makes me feel like the tech community that we used to have there

(1h 28m 18s) Tim Chaten:

> Yes

(1h 28m 25s) Wes Hilliard:

> was splintered and fractured and

(1h 28m 27s)

> I also had a pretty active presence on reddit for the longest time and used Apollo and they also

(1h 28m 34s)

> went their way of the dodo as far as I’m concerned and

(1h 28m 36s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, the only Reddit activity I get now is I get their email still.

(1h 28m 41s)

> It’s like I find a thread and I’ll just open it and then close Safari after that and that’s about it.

(1h 28m 43s) Wes Hilliard:

> Yeah, I

(1h 28m 45s)

> Just don’t have read it anymore. So like I just kind of had to give up on it and same thing with Twitter I have an account there, but it’s not active. I might retweet an Apple insider post

(1h 28m 56s)

> Because I use it to check for news because that’s just what it’s there for Apple insider has an account I have to manage it like.

(1h 29m 4s)

> I can’t wait for the day that it just finally burns down so we never have to use it again.

(1h 29m 9s)

> Just counting down to that moment.

(1h 29m 12s)

> But I’m on Macedon, so that’s nice and I’m glad that the tech community found a home there.

(1h 29m 18s)

> But I still feel like it’s kind of in its growing phase and I feel like there’s still a lot of splinters out there of people trying to do different things or just have given up altogether and stopped using social.

(1h 29m 27s)

> So I guess that’s my last input of the show before we close out.

(1h 29m 34s)

> I’ve said it before on Apple Insider, anyone who’s listened will have heard me rant on this forever, but Apple, take the next step in creating your own social network.

(1h 29m 45s)

> I know, not Ping, but we are one step away and all I want is kind of a wall system where everyone can follow each other’s “walls” where you can post status updates or photos and and have it just be family and have it like in the iMessage app and that’s it.

(1h 30m 4s)

> Just a stream of consciousness from other people that you allow in, no ads, no nothing,

(1h 30m 9s) Tim Chaten:

> You know, the old, basically the old Facebook wall mechanism.

(1h 30m 10s) Wes Hilliard:

> just people.

(1h 30m 12s)

> The whole Facebook wall, because we already have group chats, we already have iMessage,

(1h 30m 17s)

> you know, we have the FaceTime systems, you can do shared photo libraries, every portion of what you would call a social network is available on Apple’s ecosystem.

(1h 30m 26s)

> They’re just kind of disconnected.

(1h 30m 29s)

> it in the middle with a streamable private wall interface.

(1h 30m 34s)

> I don’t use Facebook, and that’s why I’m not on Threads, I’m glad they’re going federated so I can follow Threads accounts on Mastodon, but there’s just not a great central option anymore, and I’m just mourning that.

(1h 31m 4s)

> I’m not a huge fan of Mastodon, but I’m growing on Mastodon, and I’m actually about to surpass the amount of followers I had on Twitter previously, which is nice.

(1h 31m 22s)

> So it kind of makes me feel good about the transition.

(1h 31m 25s)

> So yeah, give me a follow on there, I’m usually talking Apple tech, you know, I don’t get too crazy, and you can see my streaming times there in links so that if I start to get too

(1h 31m 34s)

> busy, I can start doing that more often.

(1h 31m 36s)

> And Apple Insider, if you go to our webpage, you can see my face and my name as a byline,

(1h 31m 41s)

> click on it, and you’ll see a little bio that I’ve written about myself, and every article that I’ve written.

(1h 31m 47s)

> Inside pages do not have my name on them, that’s the secret surprise, but if you find yourself on an inside page, just know, hey, that’s me too.

(1h 31m 50s) Tim Chaten:

[laughs]

(1h 31m 54s)

> That’s your handiwork, yes.

(1h 31m 56s) Wes Hilliard:

> And I’m also on the Apple Insider podcast, you know, go give us a follow on Apple podcasts,

(1h 32m 1s)

> I think it’s a fun listen.

(1h 32m 4s)

> Go ask William Gallagher about his favorite episode of Ted Lasso.

(1h 32m 15s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, he loves Ted Lasso, so just, you know.

(1h 32m 26s)

> Well, excellent. Thank you so much for your time today. This has been a really fun chat learning how you use the iPad for game streaming and kind of your journey through the years here.

(1h 32m 36s) Wes Hilliard:

> I’m glad you had me on. I hope I wasn’t too long-winded, you know

(1h 32m 40s)

> It’s always weird talking about myself, you know, I don’t I don’t get to do it often I mean the Apple insider show is not about me So we’re talking about Apple news, but I’m glad I got to kind of discuss my journey here

(1h 32m 51s) Tim Chaten:

> Yeah, absolutely. And we’d love to have you on Vision Pros next year whenever we get our hands on those.

(1h 32m 57s) Wes Hilliard:

> – Right, yeah, that’d be fun.

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